Some things are such a piece of crap even the best skilled wrench can’t improve it , welcome to the computer world where everything is disposable .
-
Welcome to the Two Wheeled Texans community! 
Feel free to hang out and lurk as long as you like. However, we would like to encourage you to register so that you can join the community and use the numerous features on the site. After registering, don't forget to post up an introduction!
No use jivin', no use jokin'
- Thread starter mr72
- Start date
The old Yamaha would be serviceable given enough time and money. It's just not worth it to keep putting time and money into it. If there was a way to get EFI and 11+ hp out of it, then maybe, but the truth is it's too small physically for mrs72, who is 6'0" tall.
Now, my non-running !Vespa is kind of worth it for me to fix. It's a truly unique beast, a minimally-modernized steel Vespa P frame scooter with under 1K miles on it with a unique and hard to work on engine. I just don't like working on it when it's 105 degrees out, and I'm trying to avoid biting the bullet and dropping the engine. If I can't make it work reliably by the time the dead of winter gets here, I'll drop the engine and get all the way to the bottom of the problems.
Now, my non-running !Vespa is kind of worth it for me to fix. It's a truly unique beast, a minimally-modernized steel Vespa P frame scooter with under 1K miles on it with a unique and hard to work on engine. I just don't like working on it when it's 105 degrees out, and I'm trying to avoid biting the bullet and dropping the engine. If I can't make it work reliably by the time the dead of winter gets here, I'll drop the engine and get all the way to the bottom of the problems.
Last edited:
Winter,,,,such an awesome thought!
Okay. Well, there's good news, bad news, and potentially good news eventually, regarding the resurrection of the !Vespa.
Not even 900 miles on this scooter. Sheesh.
You might recall a few pages ago the variator pulley had self destructed, separating the starter ring gear from the pulley and breaking the little tabs that held the two pieces together. I attempted a repair by refitting the starter ring gear to the pulley using red Loctite to hold it, and reinforced the outside where the broken tabs had been with globs of Loctite "metal and concrete" epoxy, or was it JB Weld? Something like that. So file that data.
Also, another mod I had made long ago was to the Dellorto "ECS" -- "Electronic Carburetor System". This thing uses a little air injection solenoid to allow extra air into the carb to auto adjust the mixture in a closed-loop fashion. I had removed this air inlet hose and capped the input because the hose broke and with the airbox in place it was impossible to get to the valve to replace the hose. File that data too.
The problem WAS that after winter storage, yes that is like 7 months ago, the scooter wouldn't start. After lots of work and even trying a replacement carburetor, I got it to run, but it would only go like 3 mph and wouldn't rev above about 2k rpm under load. The tank was packed with rust and I think also the vacuum fuel pump got clogged with rust, so I laboriously cleaned the tank and then went through a jillion hoops trying to get a fuel pump to work. Finally the last one I put on was a Kohler-type fuel pump for a lawn tractor. Remember, this is a scooter with no manufacturer in existence, so original equipment parts are essentially impossible to get in many cases.
So, yesterday and today I intended to get it running again. I got sick of pulling the carb out with the airbox in place and actually broke the airbox last time I was working on it, the rubber outlet hose came loose from the airbox, so I had to remove it, and. that's no small feat. Once I repaired the airbox and discovered how lovely it is to work on with the airbox removable, I decided to make a mod so the airbox can come on and off when the carb has to come off. Anyway, that just made me happy to work on it. Scooter wouldn't start yesterday after lots of effort. I even pulled the spark plug and cleaned it with a wire brush on the Dremel, it was very black. Since I had the airbox actually off, I decided to investigate that air injection solenoid, see about reconnecting a new hose, since apparently it had been running really rich at idle. For kicks I pulled the carb off and gave it a cursory cleaning again, then put a new hose on the air injection doodad, put it all together, and after a lot of cranking, IT STARTED!!
It was running quite badly though, so I tinkered with the air screw finally settling on two turns out and rode it up and down the road in front of my house about 50 times. It got better and better running, and by the end it was finally running 95% back to normal! I think the problem was there was still some leftover bad gas or maybe water or who knows what in the little fuel reservoir that had to get cycled through before it would run right. It started back up on an instant bump of the starter several times. So I actually decided I was going to go ride and give it a real blow-out-the-cobwebs ride.
Then it wouldn't start. Starter bendix is not engaging the ring gear. I haven't pulled it apart, but it sounds like the ring gear has been knocked loose again and it is just not straight on the pulley. I'm going to crack it back open tomorrow, I guess. It got too hot to work on it. So that's the bad news. I can attempt another repair, maybe see of I can figure some other better way to get it to hold together. However, I have no faith in this part. It's broken, jury-rigged even when it was kind of working, and it's a crummy design anyway.
Good news though, it looks like SIP Scooter Shop in Germany has an aftermarket J.Costa outer pulley. The stock part is a cast aluminum part with a separate ring gear pressed on and hooked up to little fingers with roll pins, those fingers are now broken off on mine. The J.Costa part is one piece, all steel, so there's no way to break the ring gear off of the pulley. SIP has this J.Costa part in stock, and it's not astronomically expensive. They also have a slick J.Costa variator that's a rollerless design with more gearing range, lower gearing at take off and taller gearing at top revs. I sent them a message confirming these will fit this year model scooter, and once I get confirmation, I'm going to order the whole rig. Then if it all gets here and works right, I'm going to order an entire extra set including a couple of new belts while they are available. I'm sick of this lack of parts business.
So, scooter season is coming, and I might just find a way to have a working scooter by the time the temps are topping out in the 80s.
I got really ambitious about other projects, but 100+ degrees was just too much and I gave up after doing only an oil change on my Scrambler.
Not even 900 miles on this scooter. Sheesh.
You might recall a few pages ago the variator pulley had self destructed, separating the starter ring gear from the pulley and breaking the little tabs that held the two pieces together. I attempted a repair by refitting the starter ring gear to the pulley using red Loctite to hold it, and reinforced the outside where the broken tabs had been with globs of Loctite "metal and concrete" epoxy, or was it JB Weld? Something like that. So file that data.
Also, another mod I had made long ago was to the Dellorto "ECS" -- "Electronic Carburetor System". This thing uses a little air injection solenoid to allow extra air into the carb to auto adjust the mixture in a closed-loop fashion. I had removed this air inlet hose and capped the input because the hose broke and with the airbox in place it was impossible to get to the valve to replace the hose. File that data too.
The problem WAS that after winter storage, yes that is like 7 months ago, the scooter wouldn't start. After lots of work and even trying a replacement carburetor, I got it to run, but it would only go like 3 mph and wouldn't rev above about 2k rpm under load. The tank was packed with rust and I think also the vacuum fuel pump got clogged with rust, so I laboriously cleaned the tank and then went through a jillion hoops trying to get a fuel pump to work. Finally the last one I put on was a Kohler-type fuel pump for a lawn tractor. Remember, this is a scooter with no manufacturer in existence, so original equipment parts are essentially impossible to get in many cases.
So, yesterday and today I intended to get it running again. I got sick of pulling the carb out with the airbox in place and actually broke the airbox last time I was working on it, the rubber outlet hose came loose from the airbox, so I had to remove it, and. that's no small feat. Once I repaired the airbox and discovered how lovely it is to work on with the airbox removable, I decided to make a mod so the airbox can come on and off when the carb has to come off. Anyway, that just made me happy to work on it. Scooter wouldn't start yesterday after lots of effort. I even pulled the spark plug and cleaned it with a wire brush on the Dremel, it was very black. Since I had the airbox actually off, I decided to investigate that air injection solenoid, see about reconnecting a new hose, since apparently it had been running really rich at idle. For kicks I pulled the carb off and gave it a cursory cleaning again, then put a new hose on the air injection doodad, put it all together, and after a lot of cranking, IT STARTED!!
It was running quite badly though, so I tinkered with the air screw finally settling on two turns out and rode it up and down the road in front of my house about 50 times. It got better and better running, and by the end it was finally running 95% back to normal! I think the problem was there was still some leftover bad gas or maybe water or who knows what in the little fuel reservoir that had to get cycled through before it would run right. It started back up on an instant bump of the starter several times. So I actually decided I was going to go ride and give it a real blow-out-the-cobwebs ride.
Then it wouldn't start. Starter bendix is not engaging the ring gear. I haven't pulled it apart, but it sounds like the ring gear has been knocked loose again and it is just not straight on the pulley. I'm going to crack it back open tomorrow, I guess. It got too hot to work on it. So that's the bad news. I can attempt another repair, maybe see of I can figure some other better way to get it to hold together. However, I have no faith in this part. It's broken, jury-rigged even when it was kind of working, and it's a crummy design anyway.
Good news though, it looks like SIP Scooter Shop in Germany has an aftermarket J.Costa outer pulley. The stock part is a cast aluminum part with a separate ring gear pressed on and hooked up to little fingers with roll pins, those fingers are now broken off on mine. The J.Costa part is one piece, all steel, so there's no way to break the ring gear off of the pulley. SIP has this J.Costa part in stock, and it's not astronomically expensive. They also have a slick J.Costa variator that's a rollerless design with more gearing range, lower gearing at take off and taller gearing at top revs. I sent them a message confirming these will fit this year model scooter, and once I get confirmation, I'm going to order the whole rig. Then if it all gets here and works right, I'm going to order an entire extra set including a couple of new belts while they are available. I'm sick of this lack of parts business.
So, scooter season is coming, and I might just find a way to have a working scooter by the time the temps are topping out in the 80s.
I got really ambitious about other projects, but 100+ degrees was just too much and I gave up after doing only an oil change on my Scrambler.
FedEx has received the new pulley for the ailing !Vespa, and SIP confirmed that it indeed is made to fit this scooter. Had this part been available two years ago, I would have kept my prior Stellauto!
Last edited:
HAHAHA ... That's to fix the !Vespa. The Yamaha is still a lost cause in my mind. Once I can get mrs72 to stay in Texas long enough to go do some test rides, I'm replacing that Vino.
Ohhhh, man. This is today! It's literally a 5 minute job to swap this part.
I already have the scooter apart waiting on the new part to go in. Surprised how much I miss riding this scooter!
I already have the scooter apart waiting on the new part to go in. Surprised how much I miss riding this scooter!
- Joined
- May 18, 2006
- Messages
- 1,957
- Reaction score
- 1,973
- Location
- Leander
- First Name
- Paul
- Last Name
- Zuniga
Speaking of riding, we're getting into some nice weather! How's your dad these days? Lets make a plan...
Everyone is good. We have a plan to head to the museum for the show, hopefully this time without my dad getting hit by an idiot truck and breaking his shiny Triumph. I think that's early November. I meant to send you a note.
Once it's highs in the 80s or below I am down for longish weekend rides. I just don't have the time to organize them.
- Joined
- May 18, 2006
- Messages
- 1,957
- Reaction score
- 1,973
- Location
- Leander
- First Name
- Paul
- Last Name
- Zuniga
I was set to take 9 bikes to the show, then I got a "save the date" e-mail for our HS class reunion - 11/4. Dang.
Sally is itching to go riding now that it's cooling down to a reasonable level, we'll be in touch.
The new pulley came in for the !Vespa and I confirmed when I removed it that the old pulley's starter ring gear had indeed gotten dislodged and slipped about 1/8" away from the bendix, which is why it was not starting. The new pulley is a much better design. Got it installed easily yesterday, now the scooter is back to its old tricks, turns over forever and doesn't want to start. I think I just need to get it started and go out and get an Italian tune-up and it'll be back in business. I just need an hour to go tinker with it.
In other news, I have my eye on two or three "new" scooters for mrs72. Cold front coming tomorrow. Scooter season is officially here and I have to do something about it!
In other news, I have my eye on two or three "new" scooters for mrs72. Cold front coming tomorrow. Scooter season is officially here and I have to do something about it!
No kidding!
In other news, the !Vespa RUNS!!
I swapped the pulley last night and put it on the trickle charger. Fair amount of cranking today and it fired up, rode it around the cul-de-sac for a few minutes then it just died, then started with a bit more effort, and ran like it is supposed to for another 10 minutes or so. I parked it for a little while then went back and it started instantly again, back to normal.
Wow. What an ordeal with that scooter. Now off to SA this evening to check on another scoot for mrs72, then the scooligan-grandparents of Cedar Park will ride again!
BTW if mrs72 winds up liking these Kymco Like 150i scooters like we are looking at today and we bring one home, then I'm going to be seriously outgunned. I'll be looking to find a way to get another couple of hp out of my Vespa... it's got maybe 9.5 hp and the Kymcos have 13.5. Maybe I should just get used to being slow.
HAHA! I'm thinking more like start by dumping the giant exhaust/cat and putting a free-flowing muffler on instead. Then maybe consider a flat slide carb and UNI pod filter. let the ECS light blink.
Probably a bit more of a project than I am looking for! I did for a half a minute consider trying to shoe-horn a 250cc CFMoto twin in there. But the 125 literally just BARELY fits.
Thing is, LML made a 150cc and 200cc version of this scooter after Genuine stopped importing them for the US market. I know the 125cc engine changed in non-trivial ways in 2015, year after mine was made, and then the 150 and 200 came after that before LML went under in 2019. I suspect the 150/200 cylinder and piston will work on the newer 125 block, but I have no way to know whether it might work on the old block except to get one and try it. SIP Scootershop in Germany bought all of LML's parts inventory and tooling when they went out of business, and for four years they have been selling off those parts. They still have 200cc cylinder/head/piston sets availablefor under $300, might be worth a try. Problem is how to know whether these cylinder/head/piston combos made for a 200cc engine will fit on the 125 block without getting one, taking everything apart and measuring. I thought about buying the kit to just put away for some day, when the scooter needs a top end rebuild, and at that time let a machine shop figure out how to get it to fit.
Thing is, LML made a 150cc and 200cc version of this scooter after Genuine stopped importing them for the US market. I know the 125cc engine changed in non-trivial ways in 2015, year after mine was made, and then the 150 and 200 came after that before LML went under in 2019. I suspect the 150/200 cylinder and piston will work on the newer 125 block, but I have no way to know whether it might work on the old block except to get one and try it. SIP Scootershop in Germany bought all of LML's parts inventory and tooling when they went out of business, and for four years they have been selling off those parts. They still have 200cc cylinder/head/piston sets availablefor under $300, might be worth a try. Problem is how to know whether these cylinder/head/piston combos made for a 200cc engine will fit on the 125 block without getting one, taking everything apart and measuring. I thought about buying the kit to just put away for some day, when the scooter needs a top end rebuild, and at that time let a machine shop figure out how to get it to fit.
We had a nutty evening yesterday. First, mrs72 inadvertently confirmed that the !Vespa is in fact right and truly fixed, because while I was on one of a series of work calls, she decided to go out and take it for a ride. She said it started right up and ran fine except some hesitation on cruise which should clear up as we burn off more of the bad gas that might still be lurking. But the quirks of the crazy Italian were too much for her to handle... I got off of my last call and we were set to take off for a trip to San Antonio, and I couldn't find her anywhere in the house, found her sitting on the !Vespa, unable to figure out how to get the side stand down. It's an art, believe me.
Anyway, we then took off for SA and wound up buying mrs72 a new scooter, a mint condition beautiful 2018 Kymco Like 150i. Then my rickety new-from-recent-trade hitch rack made us take the very long way home as the new scooter rocked and rolled in the rear view mirror and we tried to pick our way through the smoothest, slowest roads between SA and CP.
So, great news on the broken scooters front. The !Vespa seems to be healed-ish. And the Vino is going to go to the great mods rally in the sky.
FYI, that Kymco is a delight. It's the polar opposite of my oddball !Vespa, refined and smooth and powerful and loaded with every feature you could possibly want. And it's the newest, most modern vehicle we own!
Anyway, we then took off for SA and wound up buying mrs72 a new scooter, a mint condition beautiful 2018 Kymco Like 150i. Then my rickety new-from-recent-trade hitch rack made us take the very long way home as the new scooter rocked and rolled in the rear view mirror and we tried to pick our way through the smoothest, slowest roads between SA and CP.
So, great news on the broken scooters front. The !Vespa seems to be healed-ish. And the Vino is going to go to the great mods rally in the sky.
FYI, that Kymco is a delight. It's the polar opposite of my oddball !Vespa, refined and smooth and powerful and loaded with every feature you could possibly want. And it's the newest, most modern vehicle we own!
pdef
0
The Kymco Like is such a great scooter. Congrats!
yeah no kidding. that thing is a gem, for sure. 4 year age difference between my !Vespa and the Kymco, and about 30 years of refinement and technology gap.